Hillarysworld

Sanders · Diamond

"Tea Party’s wrecking crew" (Markos Moulitas, The Hill - Op-Ed, 10/19/10)

freespirit · Moderator

Looks like Kos is trying to help salvage what's left of the Dem Party. Well, I guess that's appropriate. He and his buds had a hand in destroying the party when they fought like hell to help steal the party's nomination for Obama, in spite of the fact that Hillary Clinton rightfully won it.

I'm not sure I believe much of what he says. As I recall, DK published some erroneous (or maybe just faked) poll results back in 2008 - results which showed Obama in (falsely) favorable light.

BTW, I believe Obama was planning to stay off the campaign trail today (probably because the candidates had the good sense to send his a** home), and would be meeting with bloggers. Maybe Kos and the other Blindly Loyal Obama Bloggers got their talking points today.

Sanders · Diamond

You think Moulitas is blinding loyal to the POTUS? I have not followed him much and dont much go to DK anymore, but definitely DK and he are pro-Dem overall. He is definitely a Dem, but I didnt think he was adoring Obama. There was another article there on The Hill that was by him also - it was a contrast of optimistic and pessimistic takes on different trends in about the election and ends with "I am on the pessimistic side" or something like that. (Dont have the link anymore). He was not pushing either side, but it was a Dem-perspective on "optimism" and "pessimism" for sure.

I think even those who are left leaning are not exactly with the President lately. You see that also in Jen's couple of posts about the WH insider.. There is hardly anything that is adoring the POTUS anymore, thankfully.

There is hardly anything coming out that is true "centrist" anymore these days. No third party option that is viable does that to us.

The above article though, I read mostly as concern for extreme right direction that Tea Party wants to pursue. I also saw a video clip of Lisa Murkowski saying that if it is not written into the Constitution, it does not mean it is UNConstitutional... (got to find the clip; will find and post).

Here it is.. but what I saw was a small clip of this that starts at about 1:00 minute mark in this.

The point here is the Tea Party agenda is MUCH FARTHER to the right than Republican incumbents and the usual set of Republican candidates. So, the agenda they will push will be farther to the right. That is definitely not moderate.

-- Edited by Sanders on Wednesday 27th of October 2010 12:21:50 PM

Eminence · Platinum

freespirit wrote:

Looks like Kos is trying to help salvage what's left of the Dem Party. Well, I guess that's appropriate. He and his buds had a hand in destroying the party when they fought like hell to help steal the party's nomination for Obama, in spite of the fact that Hillary Clinton rightfully won it.

I'm not sure I believe much of what he says. As I recall, DK published some erroneous (or maybe just faked) poll results back in 2008 - results which showed Obama in (falsely) favorable light.

You are absolutely correct, Freespirit. Markos and DailyKos were notoriously horrible to Hillary's campaign back in 2008 and were incredibly biased toward Obama. I would think that most Hillary supporters would remember this. I now that I do. It was so awful that as someone who would post @ DailyKos back then, I finally just got so over it that I ended up leaving.

In any case, while I'm not particularly interested in entertaining any sort of revisionism here -- to be honest, I find the whole notion to be kinda crazy -- I will post this just so we can put the matter to rest.

Here is just one example of Markos Moulitsas trashing DailyKos, from when Hillary tried to speak out about the caucus intimidation and fraud. Note that it was not just some random blogger on DailyKos, it was written by Markos.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/18/194131/837/720/498621

"Clinton trashes "activists" and MoveOn at closed-door fundraiser

And the battle of the tape recordings of closed-door fundraisers escalates.

In short, Clinton doesn't like us and doesn't agree with us.

"Moveon.org endorsed [Sen. Barack Obama] -- which is like a gusher of money that never seems to slow down," Clinton said to a meeting of donors. "We have been less successful in caucuses because it brings out the activist base of the Democratic Party. MoveOn didn't even want us to go into Afghanistan. I mean, that's what we're dealing with. And you know they turn out in great numbers. And they are very driven by their view of our positions, and It's primarily national security and foreign policy that drives them. I don't agree with them. They know I don't agree with them. So they flood into these caucuses and dominate them and really intimidate people who actually show up to support me."

By the way, MoveOn never opposed the war in Afghanistan. The organization was created specifically to help her husband Bill Clinton survive impeachment for getting you-know-what. MoveOn's Eli Pariser responded:

"Senator Clinton has her facts wrong again. MoveOn never opposed the war in Afghanistan, and we set the record straight years ago when Karl Rove made the same claim. Senator Clinton's attack on our members is divisive at a time when Democrats will soon need to unify to beat Senator McCain. MoveOn is 3.2 million reliable voters and volunteers who are an important part of any winning Democratic coalition in November. They deserve better than to be dismissed using Republican talking points."

Well, for a campaign that has morphed into nothing but "Republican talking points", it shouldn't come as any surprise.

I'm curious though, what part of our foreign policy approach doesn't she agree with? The ending the war in Iraq part? I'd like more details on that one."

freespirit · Moderator

Kos may have expressed disappointed in some of Obama’s actions and policies after Barack was crowned, but he has been one of the president's strongest supporters in the past.

You're right, Emi, I remember how nasty Kos was in his remarks about Hillary in 2008. Remember when the pro-Hillary bloggers, some of whom had been with DK for years, went on strike because of attacks by pro-Obama bloggers on the site? Allegre was the first to go, after the site administrators continued to allow the viciousness toward the pro-Hillary writers. In the statement below, which references the strike, Kos reveals what a nasty bit of work he is. After 2008, there’s nothing the man has to say that I care to hear.

From Wiki:

Remarks about Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign
On March 17, 2008, Moulitsas stated that Senator Hillary Clinton, who was then involved in a protracted race against Barack Obama for the Democratic presidential nomination, "doesn't deserve fairness on this site" because she "fails the test of the guiding principles of this site" and because Clinton had "no reasonable chance of victory". He accused her of "fomenting civil war in order to overturn the will of the Democratic electorate" and said Clinton's "only path to victory [...] is via coup by super delegate."[21] His statement was precipitated by a "strike" conducted by several pro-Clinton diarists, even though none of these posters were paid or in any way officially linked to the site.[22] Moulitsas responded directly to the "strike" by saying that it was more like a "boycott", noting that "It's a big Internet, so I hope they find what they're looking for."[23]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markos_Moulitsas

Sanders · Diamond

Yeah, I recall the bad vibes with that site from 2008. I never joined DK, but used to read. Then, I even stopped going there.

I found thi article on Tea Party thing on the Hill and only as I finished posting did I notice who wrote and was careful to post that.

I would not be offended if you just pull this thread. I will post Sen.Markowski's video separate. That I think deserves a look.

Eminence · Platinum

freespirit wrote:

Kos may have expressed disappointed in some of Obama’s actions and policies after Barack was crowned, but he has been one of the president's strongest supporters in the past.

You're right, Emi, I remember how nasty Kos was in his remarks about Hillary in 2008. Remember when the pro-Hillary bloggers, some of whom had been with DK for years, went on strike because of attacks by pro-Obama bloggers on the site? Allegre was the first to go, after the site administrators continued to allow the viciousness toward the pro-Hillary writers. In the statement below, which references the strike, Kos reveals what a nasty bit of work he is. After 2008, there’s nothing the man has to say that I care to hear.

From Wiki:

Remarks about Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign
On March 17, 2008, Moulitsas stated that Senator Hillary Clinton, who was then involved in a protracted race against Barack Obama for the Democratic presidential nomination, "doesn't deserve fairness on this site" because she "fails the test of the guiding principles of this site" and because Clinton had "no reasonable chance of victory". He accused her of "fomenting civil war in order to overturn the will of the Democratic electorate" and said Clinton's "only path to victory [...] is via coup by super delegate."[21] His statement was precipitated by a "strike" conducted by several pro-Clinton diarists, even though none of these posters were paid or in any way officially linked to the site.[22] Moulitsas responded directly to the "strike" by saying that it was more like a "boycott", noting that "It's a big Internet, so I hope they find what they're looking for."[23]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markos_Moulitsas

Agreed, freespirit, Markos' attacks on Hillary and his adoration of Obama are pretty clear back then. I have to laugh sometimes when I remember that this is the same guy who lived just a few houses down from me when I lived in Berkeley, and someone I'd talk to sometimes at the neighborhood bar.

In any case, I don't really have a problem with articles written by him or articles from DailyKos, at least on the specious basis that it's because they are written by him or are from there. I don't think anyone has a problem with that quite frankly, and I think that if people try and make it about that, then they are obfuscating the message, for whatever agenda they have in mind.

What I DO think is disingenuous however, is to try and reinvent Markos Moulitsas as some sort of centrist or as not adoring Obama. That is patently false, anyone just has to look at the history of Daily Kos and Markos to see this, and so imo, any such remarks have no credibility whatsoever.